Z9X 8K Dolby VS10 is worse than Z9X Pro and Dune 8K

I would also really like an SDR BT2020 option! If I recall correctly, this was avaliable back on the Z9S (a box I used to have) days, based on the request of several users.

 

So to confirm, this issue is only for SDR VS10 conversion? Are there any issues with normal native DV? Does this box do FEL?

 

Hey Jimbo!

Yeah, VS10 SDR only, and so far, with the greatest of respect to all, I've yet to replicate the issues, but I'm still trying!


Native DV is fine:

No FEL, but Profile 7 is correctly converted to Profile 8 so metadata pertaining to the FEL is removed (basically spatial resampling and header entries).

CMv4.0 is supported in LLDV and TV Led.

Next firmware has TV Led metadata passthrough (but in my opinion this is a bit of a white elephant forced on us by popular "opinion", because it precludes the use of DV DM greater than the display can do - I'll post more on this when the firmware is released). But it's there if you want to use it.

It translates Level 1 and 2 trims accurately at all values of T_MaxPQ - probably the only box (possibly bar the Ugoos) to do this at the moment (and that includes some BD players!).

 

Hey Mark! Hope you've been well.

Interesting. I am not sure I understand what this does unfortunately, haha. What do you mean it "precludes the use of DV DM greater than the display can do?" On the OG Zidoo Z9x, I was under the impression that the metadata passthrough was only for HDR10. This is a different type of metadata passthrough?

 

All good mate! Thanks for asking.

As I say, I'll elaborate on all this when the new firmware drops (it's to do with DV only).

 

Thanks man. Looking forward to it. Thx for keeping the forums alive. Nice to see it pick up activity

 

Well, I hadn't seen the addition concerning the "conversion VS10 to SDR", so my test will not bring anything on this subject!
Just to reassure me that the DV read in VS10/LLDV is slightly superior in the clarity and details of the image compared to the VS10/HDR10....

 

Is there anything new here?

 

@DMDreview found another bug.

HDR10 -> VS10 -> HDR10 mode is wrong and works very poorly.

It doesn't use straight HDR10, but tonemap it to 1000 nits (why?). He tried different EDID, DV modes, resetting, etc, but nothing helps.

So you will see the wrong HDR10 on an HDR TV. Moreover, the Zidoo 8K tells the TV that the signal is PQ4000, but it is actually limited to 1000 nits and raises the black level to dark gray. For now, this mode is unusable.

The same problem was on Fire TV Max, but only for DV content.

 

I think you're getting mixed up with DV in the Dune which handles L2 trims incorrectly (Zidoo handles them correctly).

Nothing wrong with VS10 HDR but I'd recommend only using it for DV since in that case it uses the RPU (correctly) and therefore gives a similar effect to LLDV.

The Zidoo certainly doesn't tell the TV that the signal is 4000nits - Min/Max MDL, MaxCLL and MaxFALL are passed through if they exist and black level is not raised.

 

Hi, Confirmation of the vs10 issue for HDR

 

Cool - thank you for clarifying - that makes much more sense than "the Zidoo 8K tells the TV that the signal is PQ4000" because MDL, CLL and FALL are just passed through in VS10, and this hardly makes VS10 HDR "unusable", although as I said, I don't recommend using VS10 HDR as it seems rather counter productive.

But interesting observations - I will pass this onto the devs and see if they have any comments.

 

So if I understood you correctly, to play HDR we uncheck VS10?
That's right....

 

Depends on how you output HDR10.

If you output HDR10 natively I would suggest not using VS10.

Unless you prefer how it looks

What the above video misses is that when you use VS10 for HDR10 and output HDR10 you are purposely processing the video anyway. It is what it is.

 

OK, but not all inclusive:
So a native HDR10 video = do not use VS10! What do you criticize about HDR10/VS10?
Another approach, since I use LLDV/VS10, my interest would not be to view everything in LLDV........hoping to have the best image quality like that?

 

If you're going to output HDR10 content as HDR10 then I don't see any need to process it in VS10. Also it means that for those that have equipment that support it, HDR10+ dynamic tone mapping is lost.

But I don't discount it as an option - in the same way there are those who like 60Hz content, there will be those who prefer a VS10 processed HDR10 image, so the option is there if you want to use it.

LLDV is a different matter altogether.

 

Ok thank you I understand!

And so LLDV when do you think?

 

Personally, in my cinema, I use LLDV for all content.

I use a 1000nit BT.2020 LLDV EDID and an HDFury Vertex2 to automate HDR10 mode in the projector (of course this can be selected manually without a Vertex2).

Then I use frame by frame DTM in the projector.

With my previous projector which used static gamma, I used a 400nit EDID to allow the Dolby Vision processor to handle most of the tone mapping, but I found that better results are obtained from allowing DTM to do most of the heavy lifting with the new one.

 

OK, that's often how I use it.............on the other hand for SDR I prefer native!

 

I rarely watch SDR, but I must admit I watched some last night and it looked great in LLDV. But I will try natively too.