Zidoo 1619 HDR & VS10 Black Level Issues expanded...

Discussion in 'HDD Media player(RTD 1619DR)' started by Markswift2003, Jun 10, 2021.

  1. Markswift2003

    Markswift2003 Well-Known Member SUPER Administrator Beta test group Contributor

    I've not seen any blinking - can you explain?
     
  2. Visconti12

    Visconti12 Member

    Yes, minor blinking to black, regarding the colour mapping with the projector. This is my case with one movie but I’ve to double check with others and may need time. I’ll report later.
     
  3. Markswift2003

    Markswift2003 Well-Known Member SUPER Administrator Beta test group Contributor

    Ok - I don't think that is the Zidoo - It's certainly something I've never seen either on a TV or projector.
     
  4. ta0801

    ta0801 New Member

    I own a BenQ W2700 projector, which is calibrated for BT.709 and from my perspective the projector really delivers in this mode a great performance compared to its HDR10 performance.
    (Screen size is 155”)

    Because of the black level issue, I could not resist and got myself a M9702:

    And I have to say I am quote blown away:
    The tone mapping looks great, when playing UHD Blu-Ray discs which usually come in HDR10 or DV today -> that is, what I was looking for.
    And black is black…

    I would even argue, that SDR native content looks a tiny bit better compared to the Zidoo Z9X.

    Also positive:
    • 3D: possibility to enter your screen size
    • 3D: Left/ right is never swapped.
    • It feels like SMB/ NFS connection to my NAS is more stable (Linux based system)
    • It plays the Spears & Munsil UHD HDR Benchmark

    Negative:
    • No Poster wall
    • Probably will not play rare file formats
    • I “feel” lower bitrate file HDR -> SDR conversion does not look as good as conversions from high bit rate UHD Blu-Ray ISO (I don’t know, if that can be true)
    • For UHD Blu Ray you always have to play them through the menu
    All in all, it is kind of sad, but I think my Zidoo Z9X has to go..., for my setup there is no point.
     
    sojer2005 likes this.
  5. Movie78

    Movie78 Member Beta test group

    Who the hell is buying this player to use it for SDR?
     
  6. Markswift2003

    Markswift2003 Well-Known Member SUPER Administrator Beta test group Contributor

    For people with 4K non HDR displays (c.2014-15) it's essential to view 4K content (since the vast majority is mastered in HDR) and it's extremely useful, along with SDR.2020 and the LLDV hack for many projector owners.

    Don't forget that all current displays tone map to what is effectively SDR, or at least a "reduced" dynamic range (depending on their nit level and the mastering levels in the content), it's just in that case the tone mapping happens in the display. Even the mighty $60K Dolby Pulsar "only" reaches 4000nits and no consumer displays come anywhere close - The LG C9 which Dolby themselves recommend for final proofing on consumer displays only has an upper limit of 700nits for Dolby Vision.

    With the Z9X using Realtek or VS10 engines, that tone mapping can happen in the player and that may be preferable with some displays.
     
    Letmein likes this.
  7. tosh123

    tosh123 Member

    It looks like that the V 6.3.20 have fixed the VS10 support for SDR displays - the washed out picture is gone.
     
  8. Visconti12

    Visconti12 Member

    I can't reproduce the issue with new v6.3.20. Anyway I'll continue to try some more files.
     
  9. Netmask

    Netmask Active Member

    The bulk of my movies are fairly new to current, but having worked in the film industry for most of my life I have an extensive collection of movies from the silent era right through to the latest Dolby Vision releases. Some older titles lend themselves to up-scaling and many don't. Did you know in 1930 they made on 70mm widescreen an epic Western with the very young John Wayne. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Big_Trail
    No CGI back then and all the spectacular special fx were actually done, like wagon trains going over a cliff. Filming in a real thunderstorm. Shot on Nitrate and beautifully restored. Visually great but sadly sound technology was not developed then so definitely mono sound and by modern standards severely band-passed to a top Hz of around 6Khz . The depression and the looming war put an end to the early development of widescreen movies and stereo recording. Blumlein an engineer at EMI was doing experiments in stereo recording back in the early 1930's So this period was a mix of innovation and the dark ages of film - of course then came along the Hayes Office and severe censorship..
     
  10. DELUCAS

    DELUCAS Well-Known Member

    Are you reffering to the 4K Movie displayed on a 1080p screen the image is brighter and does not crush the blacks ?
     
  11. tosh123

    tosh123 Member

    I'm refering on "old" 4K Displays with UHD deep color (on my TV: 60p422/12b; 30p444/12b) but no HDR - playing HDR movies instead the HDR -> SDR conversation with the DV10 engine. That combination had also the washed colors without a black level. With the DV10 engine the picture satuation may be wrong, but the overall is more brilliant and more shiny than the SDR picture and now with blacks.
     
  12. DELUCAS

    DELUCAS Well-Known Member

    Ok thanks thought somehow they had addressed it then ….
    Will wait and see when the firmware comes out it has any effect on my display but doubt it .
     
  13. Markswift2003

    Markswift2003 Well-Known Member SUPER Administrator Beta test group Contributor

    Nothing's changed as far as this issue is concerned - seems to be Dolby's fault.
     
  14. DELUCAS

    DELUCAS Well-Known Member

    Maybe the next model out but poss by then id have another screen but 13 Years and still going ……:)
    They dont build them like they use to . ;)
     
  15. Markswift2003

    Markswift2003 Well-Known Member SUPER Administrator Beta test group Contributor

    Have you tried setting HDMI range to 0-255 ?

    Works on some displays to remove the raised black.
     
    DELUCAS likes this.
  16. DELUCAS

    DELUCAS Well-Known Member

    It improves yes but then the rest look wrong top & lower black bars look grey etc .
    I can live with it just have the same Movie in 1080p & 4K .

    As we discussed get a 4K screen but i want a Monitor less S##T to go wrong :)
     
  17. Markswift2003

    Markswift2003 Well-Known Member SUPER Administrator Beta test group Contributor

    I was at pains when I got rid of my Pioneer plasma a few years ago, but I've never looked back - and it's great having a 75" Samsung hung on the wall taking up less room and weighing a fraction of the plasma! And as for reliability - I can't remember ever having an issue with a TV since the old CRT days.
     
  18. DELUCAS

    DELUCAS Well-Known Member

    I bet you miss the old central heating days ;). Ha

    one thing ive seen time & time again with Samsung screens is the artificial look gaming pc games look on movies etc etc
    Has it improved ?
     
  19. Markswift2003

    Markswift2003 Well-Known Member SUPER Administrator Beta test group Contributor

    I don't use it for games but no, it's the same as with any other screen - turn off all the motion interpolation cr*p and it looks perfectly natural.
     
  20. DELUCAS

    DELUCAS Well-Known Member

    The one i owed years back and several ive known off i did all that but still gave an unnatural games look :(
    But id imagine the modern ones have improved ten fold .

    Maybe ive been spoilt with Plasma Cinematic look for years……. ;)
     

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