New firmware v2.1.14 beta version for ZIDOO X9S released(Music 3.0 upgrade to 3.1.8)

Discussion in 'X9S Official Firmware Releases' started by zidoo, Sep 26, 2018.

  1. Nice Monkey

    Nice Monkey Well-Known Member Beta test group

    For me a valid reason to connect a BD-Drive would be optimization of write/read compatibility. Standard players are not always very good at reading home burned discs in all possible formats.

    Other reason is always having the same functions/features/remote and overall user experience.

    As I hardly burn discs anymore, probably won't do it myself, but nice to know that it can be done. My SATA optical drive tests worked really well. I might do so if commercial protected discs would be supporter too, this inclusive UHD BD playback.
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
  2. Darkone

    Darkone New Member

    Thanks for the update :)
    Could you add the version for the subtitles in the files please ??
    Some .mkv have "forced" subtitles and "complete" but you just put the langage ...

    Thanks :)

    DELUCAS Well-Known Member

    Stutter update :

    Firmware 2.0.34
    Passengers Movie 8.75gb
    1080p 24 blu ray 264 mkv
    Audio 5.1 dts

    No stutter was seen played from start to finish flawlessly . [ No 12min stutter or slow down was noticed at all ]

    So it is the type of file some people are getting as mentioned before hand and not encoded or put together correctly that is causing this stutter fault issue .
  4. 3DBuff

    3DBuff Active Member

    Stutter issue is on smaller file sizes. Your file is large with good bitstream I think it's marked BluRay Format profile : High@L4.1 with Bit rate : 9,267 Kbps. Check MediaInfo.

    It happens on common smaller sizes files 3 to 4.5GB with bit rate : 4 500 kb/s or lower. Even 720p Web-Dl has stutter.

    Get something with Web-Dl in filename and see for yourself.

    Passengers is amazing movie in HDR and 3D :)
    Very clean image.
    DELUCAS likes this.
  5. Ekul

    Ekul Active Member

    And don't forget all the web episodes from series , itunes downloads etc.
    All stutter.
    1080p 25 Hz BBC series.
    All stutter because no 50 Hz output.
    (Has something to do with wrong edid read from tv i guess)
    Hevc 8 and 10 bit all grey and washed out picture, as if zidoo
    thinks there are no more full hd only tv owners.

    Went from 1.4.12 back to 1.5.0 and most things working ok now.
    I see less stutter , only minor frame drops in scene change.

    What a joke and ripoff it would be if they put the same Zidoo player on
    the new upcoming z series with Android 7, more money for crap firmware.
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
  6. Nice Monkey

    Nice Monkey Well-Known Member Beta test group

    OK now I understand why I never see this. Using only uncompressed BD's, most are even 1:1 full copies. Watched yesterday the original Yumanji movie completely running from an optical disc without problems. To get things solved it is extremely important to give all details possible for reproduction.
    I don't like Passengers in HDR as the overall image for specifically that movie is set far too dark for me (or my OLED TV). But indeed great movie in excellent quality.

    I can understand some are not happy with this firmware update as important things were not solved and remote control button functions in fact degraded as a side effect but overall it is a very good upgrade.
    I always have a look first at the "Update List" and see if things in there are relevant for me? If not mentioned there, one may still hope/expect something else was fixed but most of the time it will turnout to be an illusion.
    Will as the next/last review step for this update have a look at OpenWRT as that is in the update list. The next RTD1296DD based FW will be Android 7.1 based and require a more intense review, but don't expect a lot of functional changes except the new GUI used and adoption to the new OS.
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
  7. Vinny4K

    Vinny4K Member

    And have you the same stutter when you play the same file directly from your tv usb port?
    I play those small files on my tv, then i have no stutter. Must be something with the Zidoo i think.

    DELUCAS Well-Known Member

    I do not have a tv or a usb port on it .
    I use a professional Monitor .
    So have no choice but use the zidoo through it via Receiver .

    The passengers file i mentioned DOES not stutter at all using my Zidoo x10 !!

    Its the latest files out that are 3-5gb web dl in size that are causing the stutter im finding like 3DBuff has mentioned .

    DELUCAS Well-Known Member

    I have two versions of this low mp4 version way back stutter
    And recent 8.75gb :)
    And no stutter .
    Stunning image agree and sound .

    So agree with you its file format web dl and size thats causing this and the zidoo box dont like it .

    As most of mine are a bigger size format 6-20gb hence i rarley see it .
  10. Nice Monkey

    Nice Monkey Well-Known Member Beta test group

    I don't know how easy it is to deal with this? Some small intro about building quality players for Video and/or Audio first. The better the design optimized for top quality the less forgiving it will be for mediocre quality sources. Just listen to a very expensive Audio setup and you will notice than any flaw by the recording or performers can be heard clearly and might be perceived as disturbing. Playing the same material on a TV or other simple audio set may sound a lot better or at least the difference will be much smaller (it won't disturb you).
    With Video material the same happens. Zidoo is increasingly focusing (RTD1296DD e.g.) on top quality reproduction with stunning images provided the input (source material) is top rate too. Specifically at scene changes top material will typically show very high spikes in bit-rates, which are needed to cope with a fully changing image from one frame to the other. Streaming service typically are close to constant bit-rate at relative low rates. Encoders for streaming services deal as a consequence different with mayor image updates like scene changes and camera moves. Players are also optimized for the one or the other. The one included with your TV is obviously optimized for streaming (constant bit-rate) type of services as TV is all about that. Really not a big surprise that it deals better with grabs (e.g. Web-dl type of files) of live streams. This is exactly the difference between watching the same movie on Netflix (1080P or 4K) and using a real optical disc (BD or UHD) content. Netflix may look nice under good conditions but that BD/UHD-BD may look stunning under excellent conditions. For old just up-scaled movies the difference may be close to unnoticeable. The better your equipment the bigger the difference will be.

    So the real time software player component must be adjusted to the source material used as input. The main difference is not so much the compression ratio but if the encoder was constant bit-rate or not. @DELUCAS So some small files may play reasonable well and others won't (it mainly depends on the original source).
    It is not a HW/SOC problem, that one can deal with both types of material. Some media players (e.g. Egreat) offer the choice using the internal player (DVD/BD/UHD sources) or something like Nuplayer for streaming services within setup as an option. Nuplayer is optimized for streaming services. You may try another Video APP with that one build-in or any player otherwise meant for streaming/highly-compressed media files on Zidoo media players. These will probably give similar result as your TV. I am not so sure a single player APP can do both jobs optimally, something dynamic (auto real-time player select) may be technically feasible?

    Maybe I will make a special topic about this as the problem will grow only bigger with the popularity of grabbing/recording streaming services. It depends on the interest and reactions. Questions and comments are more than welcome. Zidoo is specially invited for a response.
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
  11. Appie72

    Appie72 New Member

  12. Tony77

    Tony77 Member

    Coming from a loooong line of media players going back to my netgear EVA8000, I think we should all be a bit more grateful & forgiving..
    Zidoo deserves some credit when you compare them to GIANT corps. like NETGEAR, WD etc. (they dont even LISTEN to your requests OR complaints!)

    There is NOT a SINGLE player that does everything PERFECTLY! I think its too much to expect! the technology, the hardware, the software, etc. changes TOO quickly! Then addin the interplay among them between tv types, networks, ports, source material.etc..

    Lets keep in mind we are all "FIRST ADOPTERS".. I dont know if we'll ever see another MATURE market for most products this century! lol...
    If someone knows of a TRUE player (not android based) that does EVERYTHING u r asking of this inexpensive ZIDOO player then PLEASE TELL ME..(android boxes dont count) I have 2 Dunes 4k..a solo & duo, wdtv boxes, Netgears, popcorns etc. NONE does everything perfectly.. All have their own quirks at best! In fact, my 10yr sigma based EVA9150 is still my go-to..its solid & still produces BEST 1080p picture TO DATE (including any 4k upscaled)! but that was $400 new. zidoo can almost walk ur dog & pic quality is close behind, which is more than i can say for other players!

    Maybe Im just accustomed to expect & accept "workarounds"??? idk. But Id like to offer big thnx to zidoo team for their efforts...they owe us "nothing".

    As far as the web-dls its always gonna be hit or miss. especially the 1080ps..bitrate just too low. we KNOW its a source issue bcuz the hevc WedDl reencodes DONT have the problem..that is to say, reencoded PROPERLY will fix the problem. **remember***these Webdls are not DESIGNED to play as FILES (likely intentionally). ever notice the HDTV encodes of tv shows r fine compared to the webDl of same?? test it out on some eps of Westworld, or Startrek. the hdtv captures work flawlessly. Personally I have better luck with the 720ps..
    sometimes muxing to an mkv fixes it. (10 second process) On my netgear Ive learned for some reason muxing anything to an M2TS gives me the best performance of all!(not sure why) even better than 40gb mkv remuxes. You can use TSMuxerGui to create M2TS. (also fixes 24p issues) that just might fix any webdls. that format seems to add header info that avoids buffer under/over runs. PM me..Ill try to help anyone! ;)

    PS..I pay a $200/month fios bill w/DVR..only reason I opt for captures is i cant STAND the COMMERCIALS! havent cut cord bcuz the degraded STREAMING quality of hbogo or netflix is too perceptible to me. :(
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
    godalmighty and JohnS like this.
  13. Sarco

    Sarco Active Member Beta test group

    More than a year and a half I own my X9S, and still having update firmware. I don't mind be guinea pig if it ensure update at two month rate. I did not use every update, I tried them but some did not work for me. I do not use pirate copy film anymore but reencode my collection and I do not have banding, stuttering or other problem with 2.1.12. A while ago I had problem with sound, AAC in particular, but now everything is smooth and work well so playing the problematic file with my Xbox One S is thing of the past.

    Some people here will say I am banding blind and stutter blind, for those I thank God... But also a real 120Hz TV panel!
  14. 3DBuff

    3DBuff Active Member

    I don't think anybody relays on Web-Dl as a main source ;) On occasion you run into it and what a show stopper :(

    Those files are not screen capture and I'm sure BD highly compressed files would do the same thing. As far as this issue with magic constant bitrate causing the stutter is probably BS. Most of decoders including MediaInfo is not showing bit rate as constant or variable. There is no flat line bitrate. It will always be variable. During encoding you can define constant and it will limit max bitrate and try to smooth out variations but there is not much of a difference in encoding.

    Look at my sample slow motion video posted some time ago. Both videos are from exact same setup. You don't see stutter in second video because it is not video source related. It is Zidoo player issue time based. It cycles at the same time independent from the scene type.

    I'm sure that taking one of those files that stutters every 5 or 12 min and recoding it to HEVC will eliminate stutter issue but why you would do it? The source was in h.264 by recoding it h.265 HEVC you will not get better quality. Space saving benefit over lost quality from recoding would be questionable. We don't want player like Apple iPhone or Sony PS3 players where file had to be specially formatted with audio and video for player to work with. We all bough Zidoo as one multi format media player with amazing features :) We just need the frame rate issue resolved.
    The same file plays fine on most of other players like RPi, PC and any other as not high and demanding bitrate mp4 video.

    @Nice Monkey, I know you rally like Zidoo and we all do but don't try to tell us that the player is highly sophisticated into high end stuff and it can't do a simple low bitrate file ;) Those files will not play properly on Zidoo box at all. Trust me, I tried different software players and non of them can sustain constant smooth video without skipping frames. The closet thing to perfect is Zidoo player but it still has random single frame skips on HD and UHD content. The only format that plays without frame rate issue is 3D frame packing.

    Anybody else with skipped frames issue please help me out here to get the message across ;)
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
  15. Ekul

    Ekul Active Member

    3DBuff , we are on the same level lately :)

    Its just a programming error on the zidoo side.
    As Mr zero said, zappity (same soc) fixed stutter problem already.

    To say , as nicemonkey, that this is the highest quality player only suiteble for 1:1 rips with high bitrates is totally nonsence.
    If i wanted such a player i would bought a oppo player. ( Too expensive for me)
    I choose x9s as an all-round media player with a normal price.
    But with all the stutters and color range problems every firmware i think about my rpi3....never had any of that problems with that player. Nothing but smooth playback.
  16. Nice Monkey

    Nice Monkey Well-Known Member Beta test group

    Some misunderstood me: There is mainly a difference in encoders for stationary movies (variable bit-rates) and streaming movies (fixed bit-rates). The level of compression and resulting bit-rates are far less critical.
    I do expect grabbing network video streams (not video capture) to become more common practice fairly quick:
    - Series never or very late released on BD/UHD
    - Less BD/UHD discs being sold and increasing legal measures against copying these.
    - Streaming network based services increasing in popularity and eroding quality awareness for the masses.
    Formats like web-dl might even become the main source over time!

    Also HDR got a specific implementation for it (HLG) for the same reason. Netflix is using Dolby Vision which is a compromise as the new HLG was/is not yet implemented on most current AMP's and TV's.
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
  17. godalmighty

    godalmighty Active Member

    i wonder what it look like you said about color range
    can you give a screenshoot comparison so i can know what its look like
  18. mattmarsden

    mattmarsden Member

    I’m seeing this problem with VC1 encoded blu-ray rips. For example I get this issue every few minutes with Back to the Future 1:1 blu-ray rip.
  19. 3DBuff

    3DBuff Active Member

    What problem are you referring to ? Stutter issue, or color range?
  20. mattmarsden

    mattmarsden Member

    Slow motion type stutter

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