New firmware v2.0.5 version(beta) for ZIDOO X9S release

I totally agree all settings on mine are off to a certain extent but for lcd any motion settings should be off as introduces all manner of unatural looks etc and animation type look on Movies what i have seen on many Samsung sets .

Maybe forward your tv settings to him ?

 

Lol, when I looking to replace my trusted Mede8er, I was considering one of the Dune players, but they were very pricey also I can’t find the difference between “base” model and “standard”, do know what the difference is?? (Apart from price).

What is the new model?

 

DELUCAS, you are not part of the solution. You are part of the problem.

It is not my TV that is the problem.

And price has nothing to do with it. The x10 is $230 and quite likely has all the same issues the x9s has. That's not exactly cheap. Neither is $130 cheap to me. The hardware is not the problem. The firmware is.

You are not helping. I'm sorry to sound rude but while I have been methodically testing and documenting my issues to help track down the root causes and hopefully get Zidoo to look into them, you have done nothing but try to wave the issues away.

Regarding beta firmware, there hasn't been an official update in months, and as soon as I first started to report issues, I was advised by multiple users to update to 2.0.5.

I wouldn't even be on the beta firmware if the last official version worked properly. It did not.

How many more versions do we need before DVDs play in the right aspect ratio, and before the navigation bar works for DVDs? This is basic stuff.

They advertise on their item page on this site, "ZIDOO exclusive music player, support APE, WAV, FLAC and other music formats, support CUE track. Build your own PLAYLIST."

This is a lie. Cue support is completely broken on the version it shipped with, and it is still broken.

 

Going round and in circles here .......

As ive said if you have issues with this firmware no matter what you do and cannot resolve it at this moment .

Then you have no choice but to wait for the next firmware out to see if your problems have been resolved !

So post away on here and other forums your frustrations
But common sense will kick in its either it dont like your tv or tv settings or you gotta wait for the next firmware update .

And see .

 

Thank you for trying to help. Regardless of what you may see, the frame drops are there. It's in the firmware timing. And as I said it's hard to see for many people. That's why I gave a direct link to the motion bars test file. Because it's easier to see frame drops and pinpoint timing with them.

Regarding the banding, the poster n_p verified the banding with that "World in HD" file:

"I can confirm the issue.

I'm still on the second to last firmware version on the Zidoo, where I dont have a YCbCr 4:2:0 option in the settings, but I did compare YCbCr 4:2:2 and YCbCr 4:4:4 - as well as the Auto, OFF, 10bit and 12bit modes on YCbCr 4:4:4.

The issue description ursiel provided is correct."

http://forum.zidoo.tv/index.php?threads/ycbcr-444-vs-ycbcr-422-why-the-difference.7216/page-2
Post #35

As I said, 12bit looks great in some color space modes. Now, I'm sure different TVs handle banding differently. No doubt about it. But there is no reason why 12bit should have less banding than 10bit, when it's a 10bit source file. The 12bit would just be adding empty data to bulk it up to 12bit - it should look the same as 12bit. And that's part of the problem - for some reason 10bit mode has more banding on 10bit content than 12bit does, which shouldn't happen. Because of that, I'm forced to use 12bit, since 10bit has more banding, even though it shouldn't on 10bit content. 12bit is the only mode that looks great for videos with banding problems for me. 10bit should look equally good but it doesn't for me.

I've had people tell me in here my TV isn't HDR (false), tell me my TV doesn't support deep color (false), and it's frustrating. I don't mean you. Just in general.

 

And what makes you think Zidoo will fix the issues (or even know about them) if nobody is reporting them?

You're the one going in circles. I have posted a lot of data on how this player has been behaving for me - banding, color space, frame drops, DVD playback and navigation - how is that going in circles? At least I'm trying to be helpful. You're just clogging up the thread by trying to shut me down.

I'm not posting in here to vent frustrations. I'm posting to help point out these issues so Zidoo can correct them. Obviously you don't seem to see any of these issues, so you're certainty not going to be helping any of us.

BTW, another poster just confirmed my DVD issues in another thread here (same thread as I linked to above):

"Yes, dvd playback is faulty, it's not your unit, I suppose few people in the 4K era play dvd rips."

I'm reporting issues many in here aren't even aware of, but somehow, I'm the bad guy here.

 

The issues I have reported range from DVD to UHD/HDR (banding), and the frame drops affect 1080p and 2160p (and likely other resolutions too like 720p). It's not all low-quality problems.

And just a reminder to people, when I first started to test the player, to see how it would handle my collection, I praised it for handling such a wide range of files, from 360p up to 2160p, 2D and 3D, with a wide variety of file types (avi, mov, mp4, ts, mkv, etc). I posted a whole list of file types that displayed correctly for me. So I'm not just hating on this player. I've listed the issues I found with this player since that is exactly what this thread is for. If they fix these issues and improve the way it handles some of it's functionality, I would love this player. But when they release poster wall 2.0, yet it doesn't even play DVDs correctly and there is no custom aspect ratio adjustments (critical for correcting aspect ratio issues), that leaves me wondering what their priorities are.

 

If I may comment on this, as it seems you are using much energy to keep the topic focused : for best and worst, Zidoo decided to use a forum as main support interface.
There are usual rules in a forum, but users posting any sort of comments on a FW ("I like it", "I don't have any issue", ...), in a topic named after a specific FW, are completely in their right.
If you want a topic focused on discussing a particular issue on a particular FW version, the best is probably to create a specific topic with precise title (that may not remove all the stuff you don't like, but it's probably easier to follow for all including Zidoo).
Usually not the case here, so knowledge on an issue (or solution or Zidoo take on it) can be hidden in page 17 of post A or page 7 of post B, it's pretty messy.
That's only a kind suggestion, moderators / forum owners may not agree I don't know.

 

wow...you have zero in banding, its awesome
i use lower series from you and @ursiel LG6550
with same file "World in HDR" i got severe banding when set Auto for Color Depth and minimal banding with others, just like @ursiel had tried
but lucky me, my eyes is not that sensitive to recognize the stutter that from what @ursiel had test before, but i believe it had stuttered

i hope for the best the zidoo teams can give effort for actually fix the problem that @ursiel suffered

and for me, i just really dont like about the black flashing after the movie play when we use auto switch for resolution or framerate

 

@ursiel please open a specific topic with all your findings it's difficult to remember each and any tries you have made and the occurring errors. Put them in a place under a good description so everyone can try to reproduce your findings. You did a hell of a work and it is pity to go unnoticed.

 

I agree... You have concrete repeatable evidence.... Something I wish I had before purchasing the X9S...

Maybe a title like... Buyer Beware... Know Issues With X9S... Whatever you choose make sure you reserve some posts for yourself for future updates.

Thanks for your work.

 

The pixel clock frequency (and therefore the frame rate) reported by the Vertex is not perfect. It is a tiny bit different from that is reported by true HDMI protocol analyzers from Quantum Data or AstroDesign.

@ursiel: can you check for frame drop/dupe with this clip? https://mega.nz/#!xZ0AlaiL!eEgLwmnvlEurx9FmJKxfbIWETfvCl0zKSvW8JiqtrSE
It is a movie credit roll. One should be able to easily identify frame drop or dupe with this type of clip. It is about 450s long.

 

Do you own or have access to these... Have you verified the framerate if the X9S?

 

Yes. That's why the frame rate that I mention is slightly different. HDFury can easily verify it against industry standard Quantum Data 980 or AstroDesign VA-1842.

 

I will check this out later tonight and report back.

 

Oh, man. Where do I begin?

OK, well I downloaded the end credits file and watched it. I did not see any obvious frame drops at 444 color space, 10bit. Confused, I ran my motion bars test again, and sure enough the 1st frame drop was at exactly 83 seconds, as always. I then decided to try using an older motion bars test I had (which is only 2 minutes long, so I don't like using that one as it's too short for longer tests). Result: no frame drop anywhere in the 2-minute test.

I then watched the motion bars pattern I've been testing with, this time using the WDTV Live. No frame drop anywhere near the 83 second mark. So I loaded the test video into MPC-BE and MPC-HC on my PC. What I found was that the test file appears to have some kind of issue - I'm not sure what, but it appears it may be broken or corrupt, or encoded oddly. MPC-BE starts to play the file and says it is 10 minutes long, but as soon as you click anywhere in the navigation bar, it locks up and won't play the file. It's worse in MPC-HC - it pixellates and freezes up immediately. VLC seems to play it okay. Mediainfo says it is 23.976, which the Zidoo also reports. I re-downloaded the test file and created a checksum file, and compared it to my current copy, and they are an identical match. My guess is there may be some weird encoding issue with the test file, or it is somehow broken. Here's the direct link again if anybody wants to check that file out further and report what they can find about it:

https://github.com/mifi/lossless-cut-fixtures/raw/master/FPS_test_1080p23.976_L4.1.mkv

What this appears to mean is that the frame drops I have been reporting may be due to the Zidoo having difficulties at certain points of the video due to issues with the file itself. I do find it interesting that the first frame drop was at 83 seconds, and each subsequent frame drop was spaced at exact intervals. Very odd. I still believe the Zidoo does has frame drop issues, as I witnessed them myself when watching a 23.976 UHD/HDR movie the other night. However, I was not able to see any tonight in that end credits sequence. I will again quote for reference what you had previously said about the frame drops"

"As for the refresh rate issue, it is present only for 2160p 4:4:4 mode. The output refresh rate is different for 10-bit and 12-bit. It is 23.982 for 12-bit and 23.988 for 10-bit. These offsets will theoretically cause stutter every 166.67 and 83.33 seconds resp. This is probably the reason why it has gone unnoticed.

23.982 and 23.988 are the actual refresh rates for 2160p 23.976fps content when the output is set to 12 or 10-bit YCbCr 4:4:4 resp. Other frame rates are not affected.

24.000/25.000/30.000/50.000/60.000 are perfect. 29.970/59.940 have minor offsets but I wouldn't worry about it."

So maybe at this point you can again verify this frame drop issue. I apologize if my test file has been throwing off my results. I feel terrible. I did make a short video to show the frame drops I have been seeing with that test file - watch the top (fastest) bars at exactly 83 seconds (according to the bottom timer). Sorry for the "found-footage-style" shaky cam. You can clearly see the frame drop at 83 seconds. Unfortunately it may all have been due to a problem test file. At this point I just don't know. There seems to be something odd about the file.



If somebody has a link to a good motion bars test file (that is longer than 2 minutes), please link to it so we can try it. Again, if anybody can add any info to the data wesk05 has about the frame drops this player does suffer from, please feel free to contribute.

 

To be clear, that test file plays fine without frame drops in my Mede8er and WDTV Live players, as well as my TV's native media player. But Zidoo drops frames as I have been reporting and some PC media players hate it. So I'm left not knowing what to think.

 

Well I havnt noticed any frame drops on HD but do notice them on UHD, which according to the Vertex is the mode where the framerate is off.

 

I wonder, does this stutter happen only with true UHD material, or also upscaling to 2160p? Because I couldn't see the stutter in the end credits sequence wesk05 posted, which was 1080p, and I tried it with HDMI mode set to both 1080p and 2160p for testing, yet when I watched a UHD movie the other night I definitely saw the frame drops throughout (in 444 mode). Maybe I was just missing the frame drops in the credits for some reason. I tend to see frame drops more just from regular viewing.

 

There is definitely a frame rate-refresh rate mismatch issue with YCbCr 4:4:4 10/12-bit output mode for both 2160p. It is present for 1080p also (except for 1080p 12-bit YCbCr 4:4:4 which is spot on), but the refresh rate is closer to 23.976. For 2160p, the refresh rate is closer to 24.000. For this reason, the frame dupe is more noticeable for 2160p.

There is nothing wrong with the motion bar test pattern. The reason why you are seeing a difference between the motion bar test pattern and my clip is because of the difference in motion. The top bar in the test pattern is moving at 20 pixels/frame, the middle one has a varying 8/12 ppf speed, the bottom one has 4 ppf. The end credit roll also has 4 ppf vertical speed. The ideal speed for these types of motion is considered to be 3 ppf for HD and 5-7 ppf for UHD. In the motion bar test pattern, you may not see this stutter if you concentrate on the bottom bar.

With the end credit roll, I do see "slipping of the frame" at somewhat regular interval (haven't timed it) when the output is set to 2160p. You just have to look carefully.