Hello, what does this Z9S SDR mapping HDR feature do exactly ? As a projector owner, I am looking for a way to convert HDR movies to SDR, while keeping the original BT2020 colorspace. Yes, I know this is not part of the standards, but it`s a common way to workaround the light limitation of projectors and most projectors allow the selection of BT2020 for any type of input signal. Both Panasonic and OPPO have implemented those options, as it helps a lot the community of projector owners. Thanks in advance !
It takes a standard Rec.709 stream, maps the 709 colours into the BT.2020 colour space and applies a sort of inverse PQ curve. It kind of works but is a bit oversaturated, presumably because that's what a lot of people seem to think HDR is all about. Obviously if an HDR 2020 signal is input, that passes through untouched. Unfortunately the HDR metadata gets mangled, so MaxCLL and MaxFall are completely barking and Max Luminance seems stuck at 4000nits and Min Luminance at 0.005nits in both instances. SDR 2020 is not implemented and to be honest even if you could stay in 2020 space, the HDR-SDR conversion isn't that great. That said, Zidoo are doing more than most to implement HDR to SDR and although at the moment the gamma is a bit screwy, things may improve over time. Might be worth an email to them about SDR 2020?
Thanks for the reply ! I did email Zidoo about SDR BT2020, also pointing them to how OPPO and Panasonic have implemented it, hoping they can take some insights from it. If they can accomplish something similar to OPPO/Panasonic, it may create an additional appeal for projector owners. Regards.
Hello Markswift, what happens if you select HDR off with the SDR to HDR mapping selected, and your input/file is HDR (BT2020) ? Is the output still SDR BT709, but mapped to HDR colorspace ? Please, appreciate your inputs as my Z9S is still on its way and I have started dialog with Zidoo developers. Regards.
You can't turn HDR off and leave SDR to HDR mapping selected, it's one or the other or auto. (options are <SDR Mapping HDR>, <Disable HDR> or <Auto>) If you have HDR disabled, SDR Rec.709 footage plays as normal and HDR BT.2020 is "converted" to SDR Rec.709. I suppose you could call it tone mapping because it does remap 2020 to 709 and it does apply some form of PQ curve but it's nothing like you'd get from a Panny 820 for example. In the later firmware there are then 3 "gamma" curves to choose from - <Bright>, <Vivid> and <Movie Mode> None of these are particularly good and <Vivid> and <Movie Mode> both exhibit nasty posterisation but it does indicate the ability to tweak the gamma in the SDK. To what extent I don't know though.
No worries - Be interesting to hear what you think when you get the box. It's not perfect and those expecting it to be so are always going to find something to complain about, but on the whole it's a great box and certainly the best of the bunch and the dev team really care about what they're producing.
I already own an X9S and I have to agree it`s a very well rounded box. It has its flaws, but overall way better than average and excellent support from Zidoo.
I have my Zidoo Z9S on order and wanted to follow up with what you have discovered about SDR rec2020. I am in a similar boat with a projector but want to preserve wide color space. Have you considered running the Zidoo thru the Oppo 203 to it can map SDR/rec2020?
Yes there is - SDR mapping HDR. If the source is HDR is passes through, if it's SDR, it remaps to HDR/BT.2020 and home screens, HT2 etc are remapped to HDR/BT.2020.
Even using that setting HDR output is not "forced." If the player detects an HDR compatible TV it will map everything to HDR, but if it does not detect and HDR TV it will still output SDR/709 signal. What is perplexing me, is I am running the signal thru an Oppo 203 which is set to map HDR to SDR and preserve BT.2020 and no matter what I try I cannot get the Z9S to send an HDR/WCG signal. Very frustrating... It may be going back if I can't figure out a work around.
You right. There must be hdr forced option. I told before a zidoo employee but she couldnt understand me.
Right, I understand what you are trying to do now - this quite correctly won't work if the Oppo does not present an HDR compatible EDID to the Zidoo. So is your TV HDR and the Oppo isn't passing the EDID back, or is your TV SDR and the Oppo is passing an SDR EDID?
My projector (Epson LS10000) is not HDR compatible but is capable of BT.2020, hence i’ve tried this workaround. The Oppo is allegedly presenting a 4K HDR signal and I have been able get an Apple TV to send HDR appropriately. I’m not sure what else to do. I wish there was a setting to truly force the Zidoo to send HDR/WCG.
It seems to me there should be a way to override and choose how the signal is output and if you don’t confirm it works within a few seconds it would kick back to the previous setting (just like any other setting modification).
Gotcha - I would expect the Oppo HDMI input EDID to reflect the sink EDID, hence the behaviour. Without it being able to force HDR in firmware, the only way I can think of doing this would be with an HDFury Linker, Integral2 or Vertex which you would fit between the Zidoo and Oppo and set the EDID accordingly.
