Z9X Pro and HDR10+

Hey there! I have updated to 1.0.86 and I swear this functionality was working for a few days, but now every time I switch on a DV movie, it will only play the HDR10 layer. HDR10+ will switch to HDR10+, but DV wont use VS10 unless manually choosing that mode.

 

What TV?

 

Samsung S89C

 

There used to be a bug where the base layer of a Profile 7 & 8 DV file, when played on a non DV display, in HDR AUTO, would use VS10 - but that has been fixed for a while now.

So you're right, on older firmware, in HDR AUTO, VS10 would be called in that circumstance, but that was incorrect behaviour because it didn't allow native playback of the base layer and also didn't allow HDR10+ base layers from DV files to pass through.

 

wait so now HDR10 would take priority? Don't you want VS10 to take over in an instance where DV is the only higher HDR standard?

 

Your TV doesn't support DV. It's "highest" HDR standard is HDR10+. VS10 HDR is not DV.

AUTO should always pass native standards where possible and only process when the TV doesn't support that standard. VS10 HDR is processed HDR10 but your TV supports HDR10 natively.

And, as I say, by applying VS10 to the base layer also means HDR10+ cannot be passed from a base layer.

 

maybe i misunderstood the use cases of VS10. i thought it could be used in cases where a display didn't support DV, but a movie had a DV layer. DV -> HDR10. What would the use case be for VS10 if it converts HDR10 -> DV? Why would you ever use it?

i apologize for my misunderstanding.

 

VS10 is a Dolby product and unfortunately they don't publish exactly what happens in the conversions, but it's there if you want to use it, so it's a subjective choice.

As an aside - if you were to get an HDFury device (Vertex2 for example) you could actually have Dolby Vision on your Samsung - not "processed" or "converted" Dolby Vision, but real native Dolby Vision. Best of all worlds - HDR10, HDR10+, HLG and DV!

That's what I do with my Samsung and because they're generally bright panels (and Samsung have always made extremely good panels) it works extraordinarily well.

Just a thought..

 

The only drawback is that it is kinda difficult to motivate paying 450 euros for a Vertex 2 just to have native DV. Is there really not any other cheaper device that can do the same (and only this) thing for a Samsung TV?

 

No, not so its operation is transparent, not that I'm aware of. As I say, just an idea.

But to be fair I'd recommend one to anybody at all who considers this a hobby. I use them for switching, EDID management, diagnostics and just general handiness to know what's going on - especially when you're faced with a blank screen.

 

yeah, ill definitely look into it. it is a tough sell especially if you already have a high end AVR that doesn't have any switching or passthrough handling problems. it would just solve DV for me. diagnostics is cool, but i've yet to encounter a black screen in my HT environment.

 

So, it looks like I have two movies that are HDR10+. Neither of them will play without video dropouts. Slow pans are fine but if the camera cuts to a different shot the screen goes black for a few seconds. It doesn't happen with HDR10 or Dolby Vision files except for Godzilla vs Kong. Media information shows that is a Dolby Vision file but it tries to play as HDR10+ and has video dropouts. The original Alien film is HDR10+ and same behavior with video drops.

I'm on latest firmware and have tried Auto and mapping HDR in the player settings.

My setup is:
JVC RS3100
Lumagen Radiance Pro (for tone mapping HDR to SDR to the projector)

 

I ended up buying the Arcana2. It did allow me to force LLDV, but man the Zidoo Z9X Pro HATES it. Constant resyncing, crazy weird glitches, and it completely destroyed the reliability of my CEC commands.

That has nothing to do with you, I'm currently in talks on their forum to troubleshoot, but it did make me question if it was needed for $350. In that questioning, I was researching other players. Obviously I don't want to do too many comparisons here since this is a brand specific forum, but I noticed in DuneHD's VS10 description that it specifically states that VS10 can be used in a situation where your media is DV and your display doesn't support DV.

Are Dune and Zidoo's VS10 implementations different? and if not, is one party confused about it's use cases?

If VS10 can be used to map DV content to HDR10 it might just not be worth it to keep the HDFury device. Native LLDV is cool in theory, but it also adds something to my display chain.

 

No, exactly the same - presented slightly differently, but exactly the same end result.

I've not used an Arcana so I don't know how flexible they are in relation to the Vertex 2 I use, but the thing to remember is that HDMI will resync on a change in Resolution and/or HDMI Mode and/or frame rate so the key to killing resyncs is to minimise the instances where any of those things change.

So I set a GUI frame rate of 23.976fps which is the frame rate of over 90% of content thus minimising resyncs due to frame rate. I set the Zidoo to scale all to 4K so eliminating any resyncs due to resolution and use LLDV for all content so eliminating resyncs due to HDR mode change.

So the only time I ever see an HDMI resync is when frame rate changes and that's something that can't be changed - above all else, you absolutely want the correct frame rate.

This is on my Samsung flatscreen and my JVC projector.

 

hmm, then it sounds like I need to do some testing to see if native LLDV is noticeably different than VS10. VS10 could be better than we think, but no one seems to have really looked into it.

yeah, I've attempted to minimize resyncs. the problem is that during every resync its a coin toss whether or not the whole thing works. i have blackouts during content, the zidoo GUI became 1/100 of the screen, my tv refused to see the input, etc... we'll see if I figure it out with them.